For what it's worth, I don't view myself as an intellectual. I'm a fairly bright person who likes to read. If anything, I'm an intellectual wanna-be.

I'm not opposed to intellectuals, but think a person who gets out of balance between the intellect and the heart is headed for trouble. I believe these persons risk becoming socioaths. A very interesting novel about a sociopath who looses all connection with the heart is, "Perfume: The Story of a Murderer" by Patrick Suskind. In parts, quite gross, but fascinating. I'd never heard of it, but someone recommended it in an on-line reading group I'm in and we made it a selection.

If my overall impression is correct, Ray would yell at anyone who called him an intellectual.

I'm sure not too many people at this forum read the Swedish newspaper, Dagens Nyheter. Today's front page has an interesting article based on an interview with Ray Bradbury by M�rten Blomkvist. The title of the article "Moore �r en korkad skitst�vel" can be directly translated as "Moore is a crazy asshole". In the article, Ray sounds like a bitter old man whose sole obsession is that Moore stole his title without his permission and that Moore cost Wes Clark the Democratic nomination. If anyone is interested (it's in Swedish), the article is at: http://www.dn.se/DNet/jsp/polopoly.jsp?d=1058&a=272062&previousRenderType=2

i know what fittstim is. but i will not tell

read the sweedish article... (thx fittstim)
if bradbury is that stuck up: he deserves to be robbed.

the novel "Fahrenheit 451" have its own life now, regardless of its author.

Tell me if I'm wrong... but isn't Sweden part of that coalition of countries, led by the Netherlands, that look the other way with euthanasia? In the Netherlands I believe...it's even legal there.
Thank God Ray doesn't call home o'er there. Who knows what profound stories would never hit the books for us to read!!

Here's a partial translation of the interview.

Since fittstim and jens seem to have registered just to insult Mr. Bradbury, I registered to defend him.

What these two fail to understand (and I hold no notions that they would care even if they did) is that Michael Moore is banking on the dystopic connotation of Ray Bradbury's novel. I doubt he'd have used the title otherwise. Mr. Bradbury has a right to be angry. Of course, he has no legal leg to stand on. I'd imagine it's purely an issue of respect, of which Moore has none.

The fact that Moore dodged Mr. Bradbury's call when Bradbury attempted to contact him says a lot.

People (well, people who read, anyway) are going to make a subconscious connection between the two titles, and I've no doubts whatsoever that it was intentional. In other words, "Fahrenheit 9/11" would be almost meaningless had the established title of Mr. Bradbury's novel not already been ingrained in the public consciousness. With such an inflammatory work, Moore should have at least been considerate enough to ask Bradbury if he could riff off his title. But he wasn't. That's Michael Moore for you.




[This message has been edited by Kevin Parrott (edited 06-02-2004).]

Believe it or not, but I already read the Abolition of Man. The chapter "men without chests" is by far the most inetersting.

Can't read scandinavian languages - too bad.

Cheers, Translator

The ultimate irony and insult (use of "f 911") is that the firemen were revisionsists who leached the masses of real information and knowledge. That is the message of Fahrenheit 451. It is a book of warning.

It is a masterpiece of an artist's life. Still profoundly relevant 50+ years after its publication. What Moore has done seems to fall into the laps of present day firemen and their followers. Why the title F911? He said in honor of RB's work! Come on, Mike! That's the best you could do?

No communications to the man who made literary history with the concept of the title? Maybe Mr. Bradbury was not worthy of your presence or a mere "mano y mano" discourse.

Well, one thing Mr. Bradbury has always done is speak his mind. I guess there is no doubt now about how he views MM in the scheme of things. I say, Mr. Bradbury has a right to it and a track record to support his interpretation of things.

Hey, how about Moore cast as Beatty in the upcoming remake of the "real movie," F451?

(KP's link above is worth the read. Right out of "CODA" - RB: 84 yrs. going on 31!)


[This message has been edited by fjpalumbo (edited 06-07-2004).]

fjpalumbo:

Moore cast as Beatty?

Ingenious! Inspired!

The hate fjpalumbo shows towards Moore and F911 is fascinating, considering that he's never seen the movie yet, and can't string two credible arguments as to why Moore is a bad guy. Good job, Fjpalumbo!

Cheers, Translator

I'm not sure it's fair to categorize fpalumbo's position toward Moore as a personal hate. Like some others (myself included), fpalumbo may lack respect for Moore as he (Moore)distorts all information and research to promote a narrow and fairly extreme perspective. This is okay, but he clearly skews information to satisfy and promote a previously held agenda. Do I hate Moore? No. Do I respect his integrity or honesty? No. In his public work he's a propagandist, and little more.

It's very sad for me as a long-time fan to see Ray Bradbury reacting to Moore's film like this. There is no copyright on story titles, so I'm afraid Ray has no case.

Then there are the stories of his own Ray named after the works of others (http://www.brianstorms.com/archives/000372.html />) (admitedly only minor guys like Walt Whitman and Will Shakespeare!) Not even a talent of Mr. Bradbury's stature can have it both ways I'm afraid.

I think, sadly, Ray's attitude smells of self-interest and a fear that Moore's film will confuse audiences when the film of F 451 comes out. I think he's wrong, I hope he's wrong.

His claim in the Dagens Nyheter interview that "Nobody will see his movie. It is almost dead already." could hardly be more wrong, it's clearly going to be huge and seen by millions.

[This message has been edited by dshan (edited 06-06-2004).]

Of course there is no copyright on titles, but there is a long standing tradition in the film industry that you don't use a title which somebody has already registered for a forthcoming production. (Classic example was twenty-odd years ago, when Star Trek: The VENGEANCE of Khan was re-titled WRATH of Khan - because George Lucas had already registered the title REVENGE of the Jedi. Which he didn't even use in the end. And it's not even the same word.)

Bradbury fans will not confuse Moore's film with Bradbury's/Darabont's - but the general public might. And OF COURSE Ray's objection to Moore's title smacks of self-interest!

And as for Ray's titles: they are usually quoting from other authors, rather than stealing their titles.

- Phil



[This message has been edited by philnic (edited 06-06-2004).]

dshan::

Philnic's got it right.