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Religion 101 or How is the orange crop doing?
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____________________________________

"I don't have enough faith to be an atheist."
~Rick Warren

____________________________________
 
Posts: 3954 | Location: South Orange County, CA USA | Registered: 28 June 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I'm right there with you, Rick!

I would be a-scared not to believe in Our Lord.


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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How better to start a Monday than with another column by the good bishop?


Q: You continue to write articles that both excite and amaze me. My respect for you, as I have often said, started when you were my bishop in the Diocese of Newark. Every time I heard you speak you challenged me and widened my spiritual world. I find today that often in my prayers I fall back into the humanizing of God to assist me in relating in some way. When I watch our church being torn apart, however, I realize how limiting my humanizing is. In your columns I see in the Episcopal Church a way to a new Christianity and that enables me to enter my parish and celebrate the Eucharist interpreting what I hear said so that worship becomes much more personal for me.

I feel that the Church must believe what we say every Sunday, "Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, with all thy mind, and with all thy soul. This is the first great commandment and the second is like unto it, thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets."


A: Thanks for your letter. I'm glad that this has been your experience. Raising consciousness is not easy. It brings deep appreciation from people like you, but it also brings deep hostility from those who do not see. Every change in thinking involves the death of a previous way of thinking and human beings do not do well in the dying — even when death turns out to be the doorway to resurrection.

It always helps to see progress in the human value system, but sometimes it takes a lifetime before people notice.

I grew up in a radically segregated Episcopal church in North Carolina. I lived through wrenching battles in that church as racism began to die. I lived to see the Episcopal Church in North Carolina elect as their only bishop a gifted African-American priest, Michael Curry, who was at that time the rector of a Baltimore church. He has been directing the affairs of the Diocese of North Carolina now since 2000.

I grew up in a sexist church where girls could not serve as acolytes and women were not allowed to function liturgically or to sit in on any decision making body of church life. I lived long enough to see 40% of our clergy become women, 60% of our seminary students become women and to see my church choose a woman bishop (in Nevada), Katharine Jefferts-Schori, to be our Presiding Bishop, the highest office our church has.

I grew up in a homophobic church where gay and lesbian people were treated as if they were either mentally ill or morally depraved. I have lived long enough to see openly homosexual clergy serving our church with distinction and honor, and one of them, Gene Robinson, to be elected and confirmed to be the Bishop of New Hampshire. Bishop Robinson is not either the first or the only gay bishop in my church, as the press likes to pretend so that it looks like news; he is our first and only honest gay bishop.

Those are the things that make it worthwhile to endure the tension, the conflict and the hostility that change always brings. Thanks again for your letter.

- John Shelby Spong


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Spong is a liberal over the top person who is apt to weave his theology based on his life style and bend scripture to meet his beliefs.

Time and again, somebody who lives a sinful lifestyle, no matter if it is in adultery life style, or fornication, drunkedness, greed, or a homosexual life style, you do not express truth.

And such is this Bishop Spong. A great deal of error cradled in sprinklings of truth.



 
Posts: 624 | Location: San Francisco | Registered: 27 October 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Agreed, and it's this type who supercilliously refers to "raising consciousness"!
Interesting, too, how our friend fears "doing what the Church says", but he'll throw all his eggs in the Spong basket.
As I said before, the Soviets would've let this guy alone.
 
Posts: 3167 | Location: Box in Braling I's cellar | Registered: 02 July 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Liberal is a good word.


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Didn't the Soviets leave a good portion of the Russian Orthodox Church alone too?


Email: ordinis@gmail.com
 
Posts: 344 | Location: Redmond, Washington USA | Registered: 18 April 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Not the good portion, no.
 
Posts: 3167 | Location: Box in Braling I's cellar | Registered: 02 July 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Phil Knox:


Time and again, somebody who lives a sinful lifestyle, no matter if it is in adultery life style, or fornication, drunkedness, greed, or a homosexual life style, you do not express truth.

And such is this Bishop Spong. A great deal of error cradled in sprinklings of truth.


Just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so sin is in the mind of the sinner. What is sin to some is ordinary living to others. Why must the Bible Bangers feel so smug in their castigation of others who do not share the same definitions? Love your God before all others; Love, then, your neighbor, regardless of color, religion, gender or gender preference, as you would love yourself. Do these things and all will be happier in this life, which is the only one we have any data for. The next life likely will come with another set of rules. Why worry, be happy!
 
Posts: 847 | Location: Laguna Hills, CA USA | Registered: 02 January 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Why must we always reinvent the wheel here?

http://members.aol.com/thompsonja/quote2a.htm
 
Posts: 3167 | Location: Box in Braling I's cellar | Registered: 02 July 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Nico:
Didn't the Soviets leave a good portion of the Russian Orthodox Church alone too?

Ha! Check.


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Braling II:
Not the good portion, no.

Ha! Checkmate.


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by patrask:
Do these things and all will be happier in this life, which is the only one we have any data for.

Ha!

You folks sure are entertaining to-day!

To-day is a good word.


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Braling II:
Why must we always reinvent the wheel here?

Because maybe it's possible to make it rounder!


"Live Forever!"
 
Posts: 6909 | Location: 11 South Saint James Street, Green Town, Illinois | Registered: 02 October 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The oranges are probably suffering the effects of secondhand smoke about now.
 
Posts: 7305 | Location: Dayton, Washington, USA | Registered: 03 December 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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