ragaga,

You haven't offended much anybody. There are a lot of Americans who think that President Bush is a modern-day Hitler. He's caused many hardships for our country.

He's also set many people as enemies (Iraqis, Afghans, gays) and alienated them as rejects.

Do you see any more problems that could spring up in our country that reflect Nazi Germany?

Boy, another major drift off the original topic! An interesting article: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2004/010/18.152.html

Comparisons between Bush and Hitler are simply overblown.

It is not the case that ALL Afghanis and Iraqis hate us. Be careful of the media. I just had lunch about a month ago with an Iraqi (Kurdish), and in the north at least, Americans are seen as major deliverers.

The elections in Afghanistan have simply gone too well for the American media, so they say nothing about them. It was front page news for 24 hours when the candidates boycotted. But now that they are accepting the legitimacy of the elections, it is apparently not newsworthy. I have heard that up to 41% of the persons who voted were women. In Afghanistan -- home of the Taliban a few years ago. Why is this not front page news? Because it makes it look like the Bush administration might have done something right. When the legitimacy of the elections were in doubt, it was front page news. Now that it's not, it's on page 23.

Draw your own conclusions.

well, i doubt that the media really wants to make the bush administration look bad. ask yourself whats more interesting. children stepping on landmines, cars exploding, or an election in afganistan? dying people just sell better. sad but true.
to soccer... i wouldn't compare bush with hitler. if he would be a modern day hitler, you would already be dead because you called him that. if i think the usa can turn into another nazi germany? it's possible. it happened so often in the past, why shouldn't it happen in the future. but as long as open minded people are around it won't. you decide the fate of your country.

To make the USA into another Nazi Germany, both conditions in the country and the character of the nation's people would have to be changed to such a vast extent, I don't see it happening except in a catastrophe and probably not then.

germany at the time of hitler was technically the most intelligent country in Europe - the scientist, poets, philosphers, etc found their home there. Germany became Nazi not because of a lack of intelligence, but because of a popular euphoria, coupled with fear. I'll bet a dollar against anyone who says that can't happen anywhere.
Tag ragaga,
ich habe Equillibrium gesehen; es ist sehr gut.
Cheers, Translator

This topic reminds of "The Wave" by Morton Rhue. I read it 12 years ago in school, and it was one of the few books on our schedule I really liked. And this is exactly the impression I got from this book: This could happen again, anywhere.
Nevertheless -- I do believe it is possible to learn our lessons from history. (Though sometimes it seems to me we not only keep making the same mistakes over and over again but also make them each time in a more sophisticated way...) The problem is: Does it it really do justice to compare a present situation to a similar situation from our past? Because, it may be similar, but not completely the same -- and therefore somehow inadept to evaluate by the lessons or patterns we thought we had learned from history.
I think what is most important is the attitude with which we approach events of the present. And this attitude certainly is determined by our history -- but, on the other hand, it can also be ifluenced by visions or creative new ways of thinking that have never beem applied before and enable us to tackle today's difficulties in different and (hopefully) more successful ways than the ones we tried in the past. And this is -- finally, we are getting back to our original topic -- why I think visionary writers like Ray are so important. By taking us with them on their journeys through playful, sometimes utopian scenarios, they can provide us with new ideas and, what is more, the hope to find new solutions to overcome patterns like totalitarian societies ending up in "funeral pyres" and self-destructs.

Don't forget, during the 40's Drew Erickson was maniacally swinging that scythe for some time!

Finally, I found the time to read that one. Still not really sure what to make of it. I find it quite tragic that, in the end, Drew becomes the very person he not wanted to be -- I think at some point in the story he realizes that, as this task must be performed by someone, it better be someone with prudence, due to the huge responsibilty it implies. But, after his family died and he lost everything that was dear to him, these thoughts become irrelevant to him and he keeps on persuing his task in a kind of nihilistic rage.

The Scythe is, for me, one of Ray's most haunting stories. On a rational level, there is something awry with the story, but it has a powerful psychological resonance.

(It was also one of the first RB stories I read, and was actually the story depicted on the cover of the UK paperback of The OCtober Country which I found at a jumble sale when I was 12. )

Phil

When I first read it, my reaction was kind of, "What sort of a story is THAT?" But my admiration has grown as I've never found another one like it!

Read Scythe 40 years ago, and questions it raised have prodded my belief system ever since. Just re-read it for the first time, and am floored all over again - this goes far beyond being a mere story....

As for the F451 discussion, always felt the story was less about censorship than it was about complacency. We are certainly drifting as a society now. On the surface it appears that we do let the media decide for us what is true, and not only don't question it - we don't even seem to care.

And yet - in my private conversations with most people, they ridicule what is said by the media. They just can't be bothered making a fuss about it, because whatever they say will be shouted down by the special interest groups who are the media's darlings.

Things will go so far, then the pendulum wil swing back. Glee

jupp. i know what you are talking about