Trouble-makers don't seem to hang around too long. Think they tend to get bored.

An open door to anyone is this site. Dandelion should install a ""filter"" that won't permit postings using certain words. Censorship? Such ideas, however, tend not to stay within the parameters which keeps things safe and sane, but, before long, sink to abuses where the need to blow apart the boundaries occurs and everything is back to the same spot...just a different generation, or a brand new set of personalities.

Years ago there were rules for decency, but they were not looked at as rules, because it was common sense! Generally, no one had to be told how to behave, and if you didn't there was this thing called shame, or at least someone blushed about it. Common sense isn't common anymore.

Ray Bradbury's memories of his family are his anchor in common sense and decency. His family still sits on the porch on summer evenings. They are unharmed by time or changes in government, life or death. In this place of eternity is Ray's neighborhood, where moth or rust do not corrupt. How do you explain this to the artless rascals that come seeking an audience? You don't, tho some, including myself, try, and we find ourselves amidst over-turned tables and chairs...

In my opinion, most if not all boards should have an off-topic area. Of course, a lot of the worst board problems originate there as things tend to get extremely personal. On the other hand, when there is no off-topic area, things sometimes get personal anyway.

With regards to Imskipper, Nard, Dandy, Mr. D, others here often: Think of the great off topics we've had over the years - Serling, Lewis, Tolkein, Nolan, Pink Floyd, Addams, Shakespeare, education, theolgy, politcs, mythology, publishing, censorship, technology, cinema, tv, poets, advertisement, news items, web sites, cultures, writing, tragedies, honors, ....on and on the list could go.

It is needed.

(Quick addition, this posts is something like #10172!!) Imagine the communications that have transpired here. On currents of electrical impulse and beams of light. Mr. B wrote of it long before the technology existed. ** Agreed, Imskipper: I miss talking about the great Bradbury stories!!

Getting off topic is a part of the human condition. In my classroom I often have to ask my students where the conversation or train of thought originated. That's fine and enjoyable even when arguing a point. It's the civility (mentioned by each of you who have been here for quite awhile and whom I view as mentors in my ongoing education of "Ray Bradbury" man, icon, magician, and literary marvel).

We have only had to "soap" a few times for good reason. Is that censorship or maintaining civility for the good of the majority? Some of the recent posters would rant it is the worst type of thought control and then go on to blame it on Americans (or individuals with faith) and all they stand for. So, in their eyes we have become the firemen. Wow! Ironic, isn't it?

Let the discussions continue free and open. Let's just restrain from throwing fuel on the fires of those who spew far from the intended discourse.
Whew! Finis on this one.

I see some very anti-Translator messages here. Some people here appear to express outrage at things they themselves fueled. The politics debate about Anne Frank would not have started without someone posting a thing on N Korea (dandelion, I think), to which I simply responded with a cautious, and factual, response, which was then immediately attacked by very many people who ended up calling me a rotten child and similar names. I believe that people should take resposibility for their posts, and should defend their reasons and points of view if they express them publicly. Either people shouldn't post things that are highly controversial, or if they do, they should have the ability and will power to defend their posts. Now, because I've tried to defend my point of view against all forms of attack on it, I'm being called a "trouble maker" who's damagaing the reputation of this message board. There was no mention that I have participated in little discussions about literature or the merits of certain movies (which shows that politics is not the sole reason I'm here), and have started Bradbury threads that were concernced only with Bradbury. I'm feeling kind of low about the whole issue, offended almost, and am thinking whether or not to leave the messageboard altogether. I will not change my behaviour, and I will question people's motives and reasons when I think questioning is needed, so that's not an option. It's up to you all right now to persuade me (or dissuade me) from staying or going. Pterran, Dandelion, Ought Not, Nard, fjpalubo, grasstains, groon, Mr Smith, Mr dark, imskipper, you are the ones I rememeber speaking most often to. If 7 of you want me to stay, I'll stay. If not, adios and cheers.
Cheers,
Translator

What is this...Survivors?

Translator, sorry, have not followed a lot of the threads lately because I've been busy or out of town. Did I have a rub with you? If I did, I don't recall it. Don't leave ...is my vote...

To me, the question is not what "others" want. Do you want to participate in a Ray Bradbury centered board where a civil exchange is what is wanted? That's your question to answer, not anyone else's.

The tone of the board took a turn that many of the veterans here felt was overly personal and included attacks and bigoted characterizations. Did you contribute to that? I was called an anti-semite (not by you) and that's not the spirit this board has held.

Frankly, I read several of your posts and they seemed dogmatically anti-american. If you didn't like Dandelion's post, then respond to the post by addressing the issues, not making over-generalizations about americans or claiming that Bush is a hate-monger with nothing but your own obstinance to back it up (may not have been you -- I didn't memorize who said what). Most of it disgusted me.

While I wait for votes to come in, I'll only contribute to this thread. I have to contend with your classification of my posts, Mr Dark, as dogmatically anti-american. I am perhaps dogmatically anti-current-american governmetal, but there is a difference between that and your accusation. I believe I even defended america at one point or another. If you had read all of the posts, Mr Dark, you would find that I tried to steer the conversations away from generalizations, and into specifics. Furthermore, my reasons for claiming that Bush is a hate-monger were not backed solely by my obstinacy, but by facts. It is precisely this sort of innacuracy (on the part of Mr Smith) that led you to be called an anti-semite, and it is this innacuracy that is now causing me to be called and anti-american troublemaker who's being hard-headed about Bush with nothing to back me up but my obstinacy. I still would like to see which way you swing, Mr Dark, so do vote on my presence. I wish not to be in the way of people if they don;t want me to be there, but I'll stay if they do. It's really not up to me. Anyone out there who also wants to vote, and whom I haven't mentioned, is welcome to. Thanks Nard.
Cheers, Translator

Translator. You asked, I answered. That's how the posts came off to me. In either case, the specifics of Bush's policies have nothing to do with Bradbury, so are irrelevant to this board.

I'm not voting. I said what I think. If your interest is in discussions on Bradbury and his work, you're welcome here. If you're (and anyone else) going to "go postal" and make characterizations and engage in hate speech, I'm not really interested in that. But, I don't own the board.

The idea of people voting you on or off the board is not the question. The question is whether or not you want to particpate in the board in a way that celebrates Bradbury's work (the stated mission of this board). That question is for you -- not "us" -- to answer.

"Celebrating a lifetime of wonder and imagination".

P.S. I'm not interested in reading all the "angry" posts on politics -- that's not why I come to this board. It was those very posts that irritated me so much. This is a BRADBURY board.



[This message has been edited by Mr. Dark (edited 03-08-2004).]

Indeed it is. Notice, however, how the politics debate started. Not by me; I was merely a respondant. That's one. If you're calling for people to post nothing but Bradbury material, you will soon find out that things will get awfuly quiet around here. As someone correctly mentioned, conversations have a way of going off-topic pretty frequently. Rereading some of the previous threads from way back, I noticed that you've participated in many of them. That's two. I'm ready to uphold the mission statement of the board, in my own sort of way (as I thought I was doing up to this point. Indirectly, perhaps, but that shouldn't matter). That's three. I'm not interested in reading angry posts on politics either, but I am interested in debating the various political points OTHERS HAVE POSTED (sorry for the capitalization, but I cannot emphasize that enough). I think I owe that to the spirit which Bradbury tried to infuse his work with(curiosity, exchange of experiances, points of view, democracy, censorship, etc are all related, and are oftentimes the driving forces behind Bradbury's books (at least that's what I think)). That's four. Finally, the vote is necessary. I have to judge the general feelings of the other posters out here. If you chose not to vote, don't; I'll just count you out of the final tally. I promise to behave exactly as I have up to this point, and I will not change one bit when responding or starting to/new threads. I will debate as much as I can, and I will pose questions and disagree when questions or disagreements are necessary. There is one thing I need to know, though - are the other people here interested in those kinds of things or not. That is why the vote is necessary.
Cheers, Translator

Well, this is a first. Now things are going email. And all it said was... I was stupid if I liked Fahrenheit 451. Good Grief!

Translator: It's not about you. It's an open bulletin board with a mission statement about celebrating Bradbury's work. Before the last month or so, this has been -- by and large -- a safe place to come and avoid the testoterone-driven fights that occur on other boards. If anyone wants to participate in a way that constitutes a celebration and investigation of Bradbury's work, they should participate. If they're looking for mean-spirited political or religious debate, name-calling, bigoted generalizations, etc., there are literally thousands of boards out there for that.

Forget the vote. Who needs it?

Mr. Dark, I couldn't agree more. This message board is supposed to be devoted to celebrating the life and work of Ray Bradbury. If people want to engage in the kind of ugly and mean-spirited dialogue and name-calling that I have seen over the past few weeks on this message board, let them take it somewhere else.

Mr Dark
others...

You guys are right. It's a real hassle trying to convince some people that the world is not flat... except locally. The really snotty and stupid (they think otherwise)...are tiresome and contribute nothing. Serious new visitors should not have to go away aghast!

Fair enough. I tried to give people a chance to determine the composition of the message board (people-wise). As only one person voted, in the positive of all things, I'm guessing that everybody agrees with me being here.
Cheers, Translator

Welcome to the "pub" when Ray was in Ireland
he soaked up the atmosphere of the locals!?
We all have a common denominator, a keyboard, and a monitor. Also an endearment of a loving eye for detail, and heart in the author Ray Bradbury. It seems to me the dust should settle, because he deserves the respect. He is 83 years young, and this is getting outside the lines for sure. His humanity has produced a reminicence of an age we seldom see, or experience anymore.
I recall the story of the children traveling back into the past. The future held no Fourth of July, no Halloween, no Christmas! They chose to run away from thier future into a past rich with joy, and
tradition. I have been a member here a while
and enjoyed the extent of shared wisdom, wit, and know how of all its contributers.
It is the vast diversity of Rays imagination that has drawn many to this board like so many moths to a bright original flame. Everyone should be able to express their admiration for RB. He definitly breathes life into our own, and I must agree with Fpalumbo that we can take much from this forum. I just would rather see the construction of common adoration for a rare talent. Than the rampant flaming on trivial issues. But then again if given ruled paper?!!!
Uncle