Right -- I already noticed there was an interesting discussion going on about that story on another thread. Looks like I'll definitely have to reread that one!

"The existence of religion as an objective fact has not the slightest bearing upon the validity of the beliefs included in religion." (H.P. Lovecraft, November 22, 1930)

Gothic:

Lovecraft wasn't exactly the epitome of religious fervor, but can you put that in more layman's terms, exactly what Lovecraft said there that you quoted....?

Wouldn't it be truly scary to wake up some morning and find that we were all there is, and we are responsible for our future and that we are become as gods, with the power to change and creat new life. Maybe the thought is just too scarry. That might explain why so many find such solice in religion and its answers to, as yet, unanswerable questions. I believe that Ray would have the most optimistic hope that we make it into the future and populate the universe with our kind. Would that we were worthy.

[This message has been edited by patrask (edited 11-10-2004).]

"Are there things in the Universe that we cannot know in the usual way of observing and measuring, but that we know in some other way--intuition, revelation, mad insight? If so, how can you know that what you know in these non-knowing ways is really so? Anything you know without knowing, others can know only on your flat statement without any proof other than "I know!"

"All this leads to such madness that I, for one, am content with the knowable. That is enough to know." - Isaac Asimov

Progress in science is that yesterday's unknowable is tomorrow's understandable. Stay tuned, ya ain't heard nothin' yet!

I really enjoy scripture's descriptions of man trying to be like God, and when he gets up there a bit thru science and his own efforts, God swats him down, lest his soul swell beyond recognition.

Or, that man eventually nearly destroys himself, and God sends out fiery angels to 'save' mankind before it completely obliterates itself.

I think the universe is populated with billions of worlds with intelligent life! Perhaps that is one of the reasons why the largest radio telescopes in the world are not allowed to 'broadcast' signals, but merely 'listen', just in case 'somebody' hostile is passing by . (That is actually the official reason!).

If some far more moral, intuitive, wise 'creatures' happen to come across this sad planet, which contains 'life', human life, since the dawn of life that has been bent on destroying itself and everything around, I suppose it would be either their compassion, their sense of right, or combination thereof, to step in and halt man from destroying themselves further.

Since heaven in scripture is a physical place, and the universe seems to be infinite, I sometimes feel like a bird in a cage trying to understand the simpliest things beyond my bird -sized brain, when in fact it is so profoundly beyond my capacity to understand that I am really left to ponder seeds and gaze out my bars thru the window and ...only wonder....

Boy, that must be some God, who cares about some stinking little people on a silly little planet out in the middle of that great big universe. It just seems like we ought to take care of ourselves and save Him all that trouble.

Does the idea of a loving god, and the idea of people trying to take care of themselves, necessarily represent a mutually exclusive proposition?

[This message has been edited by Mr. Dark (edited 11-10-2004).]

Going to patrask's quote on science . . .

At Nortel Networks, the BNR labs held a kind of open house for all the non-research employees once a year where we could go in and look at all the technological advances they were working on. It was very cool.

I remember one year, they had made thousands of badges to hand out to visitors. On the badge was a quote by Arthur C. Clarke, as follows:

"Any sufficiently advanced technology looks like magic."

I have thought about that quote for years. When I think about the technology we take for granted, I'm amazed. I'm in North Texas and have a sister in Alaska. I pick up the phone and carry on a live conversation with her. When you look at the distance and all the equipment that the electricity has to pass through, it is staggaring that we can carry on this live conversation. At times, even technology I have already incorporated into my life looks like magic to me.

Remember when microwave ovens first became available?

Nard: I think the implications are fairly obvious. The fact that religion is with us does not mean it holds any semblance of truth. A great many people used to believe that the earth was flat. They were wrong.

My wish for Humanity is that we all strive to become Loving Gods to each other.

Gothic:
Flat Earth? Used to believe? Come on. There are a lot of organizations 'around' the world that STILL think the world is flat.
(Check out their reasons for going to Mars!! LOL)

http://www.flat-earth.org/

When someone like Jesus says HE is truth, the implications behind the evidence is so strong that it changed the calendar and started it at number 1 all over again. Every generation, every person, either discovers truth or foregoes the opportunity.

ALSO:

This thing about no one seeming to know the earth was round so many centuries ago is false. People long before Christ probably knew the Earth was round. Augustine, writing in his complicated work, The City of God, around 460 A.D., writes that....many people believe that the Earth is actually round. He goes on to speculate how strange the notion, really, that they are saying that..."while I walk outside in the daylight air, many are saying that there are people on the other side of this world walking with their feet pointed up towards me, that when the sun goes down for me, it goes up for them. How strange all this is..."

About 20 or 21 years ago I was a college recruiter for then DeVry Institutes (now University) and would go into high schools with a lecture on high technology, electronics and computer science. There was a 12 minute film and about a 35 minute slide show. On one of the slides was a photo of a cell phone with the caption "Believe it or not, some day you will be to carry a telephone in your pocket," and the students would just roar with laughter. On that same slide presentation was a photo of the map in the dash, GPS.

And now I have a new digital camera that will take short videos. What's with that???