Ray Bradbury IS a great man and a great writer. Farenheit 451 is not ONLY valuable as SciFi BUT it made virtually everyone aware of government censorship and consequently SLOWED it proliferation. It is easily as important as 1984 in the social sense.

I am not very understanding of Mr. Bradbury's position, as recently stated on NYtimes.com, about Moore's Farenheit 9/11. I have not seen Moore's work so I am NOT commenting on it. I am only commenting on my understanding of Bradbury's position on Moore's title "Farenheit 9/11".

The words "Farenheit 9/11" are not the same as the words "Farenheit 451". Obviously the former is a play on the latter, just as many make different references or word changes to (or about) any famous thing or artistic work.

Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery I am told. Therefore, IMHO Moore's use of the play on words of of Bradbury's title is very sincere "flattery".

"9/11" on a GOOGLE search comes up with 14,700,000 hits. "Farenheit" is in ANY English language dictionary in the world.

A study of the "gone with the wind" and "the wind done gone" controversy and subsequent court decision would probably shed a lot of light on this. The final decision went, I believe, to Randall although there was also an out of court settlement, probably to just avoid further harassment and let everybody save a bit of face.

Happy 84th birthday Mr Bradbury and may you have many more of them and thank you for a multitude of great stories that I read as I grew up.

das

This is MY opinion - I would like to see if anyone agrees or disagrees with me.

What's the point of causing trouble where trouble isn't fruitful? Please, Mr. Bradbury, stop acting like a baby.

Appropriation and misuse of someone else's title is not a freedom of speech issue. It isn't a legal issue either, but is one of taste and class, which Mr. Moore did not display. A tribute, this is NOT!

I am SOOOO disappointed, Mr Bradbury.

I'm Norwegian and I learned to love your stories as a child and in Norwegian. Since English tutoring was so slow at school, I taught myself to read English (using only a dictionary) so that I could read more of your stories (and those of other greats, like Heinlein, Asimov, and Clark).

You have entertained and enlightened countless millions with your work, and been an inspiration to aspiring writers for decades... but now I am totally shocked and disappointed and angry. For the first time I'm thinking of your person i negative terms: stupid, childish, petty... even demented.

Are you an artist or are you a (expletive deleted) corporation, Mr Bradbury? And you don't OWN the word 'Fahrenheit', or have exclusive rights to putting a number after that word, do you!

If you don't clean up your act (childish, as some other poster pointed out - indeed) I'll take my Bradbury books and find some way to make the paper reach Fahrenheit 451.

I'm sorry to say, even if you do change tacks (you greedy, petty jerk!) I have permanently lost a lot of respect for you. I feel like writing you an obituary. In a way, a childhood hero of mine just died.

Very, very sad.

[This message has been edited by dandelion (edited 06-19-2004).]

Dandelion/Exmort,

Please see my post under the DEAD HEROES thread.

Thanks!

Best,

Pete

I feel compelled to write a few words in response to Ray Bradburys insecurities which have recently surfaced.
Whilst I cannot agree more with the majority of message board comments, life on planet earth is far far too short to dwell on such insignificant and largely unimportant events.
For goodness sake.....let all get a life.....including you Mr Ray Bradbury.

I have specifically joined this website to comment on this issue. So please forgive me if I'm not at the same level of commitment to Ray Bradbury's works as others in your midst. Ray Bradbury is definately on of the great Science Fiction writers, along with Kurt Vonnegut, Asimov and Frank Herbert he inspired me to be interest in the future and to be interested in how technology could affect that.

There are a few great Science fiction books that redefine cultural awareness For example: Brave New World by Aldous Huxley is one example of defining work that sets a cultural perspective for generations to come on issues of Social Control and eugenics. The there is George Orwells 1984 about the use of tyranny and social control.
Which Brings us to Mr Bradburys great work.
Farenheit 451 is inspirational because it deals with censorship, the restriction of knowledge much in the same way that Orwell and Huxley changed our ways of looking at potential futures so did Bradbury.

But all of this is stating the obvious. Or is it? Ray Bradbury seems now to be offended that Michael Moore has been inspired by him and uses the title of Farenheit 451 in a wry parody/tribute for his film Farenheit 9/11. Bradbury has commented before he has even seen the film and with all due respect he's commented before he's had time to reason out his response. I disagree with Michael Moore on many things but he is attacking the administration that has constantly undermined scientific progress because it didn't fit their agenda and constantly progressed to the removal of civil liberties in the United States and the world. George Bush and his cronies are the BIGGEST potential threat to human progress and safety since Hitler. They are not yet as bad, but then Hitler had a good 10 years to get ready, I don't want Bush to get that Chance. I know this is an extreme statement but I suggest you go to http://www.ucsusa.org/
To see how many scientists feel about George Bush. This is one example of people who see Bush as more than just a partisan opponent but as a danger to all.

If you're an American Democrat I hope you vote, if you're an American Republican I'm sorry for your dilema choosing between right and party. Intelligent and open-minded American Republicans are now faced with supporting their party or defending their nation against a party leader who has no resemblance to the values of wiser Republicans like Eisenhower, a leader who is dragging the nation into a future of Fundamentalism, destruction of the Constitution and making America a hated tyrannical power in the world. I currently am supporting the Democrats not because I agree with them but because they are the only party that can save America from George Bush and the dark dangerous future he offers us.

Michael Moore is incedibly critical of the Democratic party in much of his books, don't let anyone fool you that he is doing this to support John Kerry. He is doing this because he is a patriot and fears a man who is harming the great nation of America. George Bush took 9/11, like Hitler used the burning of the Reichstag, to allow him to install his dangerous ideology in the mainstream of American politics.

This has wandered a lot I know but 9/11 IS the temprature at which Freedom burned, Farenheit 451 is the book that inspired others to see the dangers that lie ahead of us one of them being Michael Moore. Thanks Mr Bradbury now get over your artistic ego, and maybe start looking at what is going on in your nation that is more important than your copyright.

This is a rather bizarre post. We can no longer distinguish between Bush and Hitler? These attacks are trojan horses -- using a Bradbury connection to prattle on about politics.

Again, argue the issue. Bradbury has NEVER claimed he had a copyright on the word Farenheit. Why do you keep arguing that issue? It is irrelevant to anything.


[This message has been edited by Mr. Dark (edited 06-19-2004).]

I was looking forward someday to giving F/451 to my son when he's old enough to understand, but it looks like I'll have to also explain that the man who wrote it was a trivial person, not to be idealized.

Mr. Dark,

I think the reason the same argument keeps coming is up is that these people are all reading from the same talking points list:

1.) Bradbury holds no copyright on the title and, thus, it may be used as one sees fit,

2.) Bradbury is a small-minded man to object to the usage of his title,

3.) Or if he's not small-minded, he's greedy,

4.) Michael Moore is neither small-minded nor greedy and is using the title and his movie for great things for this country because:

5.) Bush is evil. And so are the Americans who agree with him.

6.) Oh, and all non-Americans are saints.

I guess you and I were left off the talking points list.

Best,

Pete

I find it very interesting that I have just read that "a new edition of the book is scheduled for release in eight weeks, Bradbury said, and plans are in the works for a new film version, to be directed by Frank Darabont." (Associated Press 6/19/04)
This must be a very new development because there aren't even any actors signed on for the movie (see imdb.com). So now who is trying to profit from whom? You should be thanking Michael Moore for giving your future work press it wouldn't otherwise get!

Hmmm. Ignorance must be bliss. A remake of F451 has been in discussion for YEARS and YEARS.

Pterran:

I agree. I missed the talking points bulletin, also. Most of it is based on false accusations about Bradbury. He has never threatened to sue. He has never challenged anyone's right to have alternate or even contradictory viewpoints. He has never said he has a copyright on "Farenheit". These people are all arguing against "air". Classic straw man arguments. The have invented things Bradbury has said, and are arguing against their own inventions -- rather than against what Bradbury has said and done.

For all the virtues of the internet, these posts represent its "bad" side -- it's ability to spread unfounded and fabricated accusations which then take on a life of their own.

This is why, in my classes, I require students to research in books and libraries. The internet has its role -- but the establishment of objective truth is not one of its objectives or capabilities.

Think, people. Research, people. Argue what is real.


[This message has been edited by Mr. Dark (edited 06-19-2004).]

I also was dismayed, Mr. Bradbury, to see your response to Mr. Moore's film. According to the Associated Press, you stated that you are "hoping to settle this as two gentlemen, if he'll shake hands with me and give me back my book and title."

The AP also wrote:

"He didn't ask my permission," Bradbury, 83, told The Associated Press on Friday. "That's not his novel, that's not his title, so he shouldn't have done it."

While I can perhaps understand your frustration, as others have noted, the two titles are different. One is a play on the other; there is nothing for him to "give back" because he did not take anything from you. Farehheit 9/11 IS Mr. Moore's story; it belongs to him.

It seems to me that your response favors the Bush administration in its reelection bid, and it's practically impossible to imagine that you favor that result. Please, I implore you to consider retracting your objections and, instead, throw your support behind Mr. Moore's film as currently titled.

Dear Mr. Bradbury,

I have enjoyed many of your books over the years. How can you, with such an amazing mind, object to MMs' obvious tribute to you while creating a masterpiece of political documentary? ( i would really appreciate an answer )